catskill style streamer

[streamertyer]

Ed,
To answer your question - there are streamers and there are bucktails. Featherwing and hairwing, respectively, if you will. Although, most times both will be thrown into the 'generic' classification as 'streamers' (something long that mimics baitfish). I tend to keep them separate myself. Heck, I've seen people refer to some flies as 'bucktail streamers'. Can't wrap my head around that one...

[Eperous]

To answer your question - there are streamers and there are bucktails. Featherwing and hairwing, respectively, if you will. Although, most times both will be thrown into the 'generic' classification as 'streamers' (something long that mimics baitfish). I tend to keep them separate myself. ...

Chris - I have the utmost respect for your indepth knowledge of streamers AND bucktails, so I had to appeal my case to a higher authority - Joseph D. Bates, Jr. via his book, Streamer Fly Tying and Fishing. While Bates does say streamers are generally thought of as having feathers, and bucktails hair wings, he does write the following,

"The point where a hair wing fly becomes a bucktail and a feather winged fly becomes a streamer is an arbitrary one."

So I'm hoping it's not totally wrong to "loosely" group them together, though most fishers of these wonderful creations can probably tell the difference between a streamer and a bucktail...

I rest my case, and await the jury's verdict...

Ed

[ted patlen]

bates also stated when writing about the roosters regret...that they tied the feathers on in streamer fashion...ike a long skinny flag a.k.a. streamer

i tend to think that feathers equate streamer...bates book is also titled streamers AND bucktails

what ever floats your boat

yo

[Eperous]

... i tend to think that feathers equate streamer...bates book is also titled streamers AND bucktails ...

Yikes, now even the man - Joe Bates, himself - is in question...

Yo - My copy of the book is a first edition, 1966 Stackpole Books issue that is titled --- drum roll please, STREAMER FLY TYING AND FISHING --- but Bates does talk about streamers AND BUCKTAILS between the covers of the book...

Is the boat now floating, or still below the water's surface with the caddis larva, mayfly nymphs, and baitfish imitated by - Shhhh... - you know what...

Let's not take life too serious here, else's we'll all go nuts - like me....

[streamertyer]

I think this should put the issue to rest....

streamersbucktailsbates.jpg (15.17 KiB) Viewed 42 times

[Eperous]

Sneaky Chris.... what's the time frame of YOUR EDITION....

Is it BEFORE Bates found religion....

Or AFTER he became senile...

I'm not ready to run up the "white flag" yet, but as always, ready to learn from the masters - you guys...

Ed

[redietz]

But the title Streamers and Bucktails doesn't preclude bucktails being a subset of streamers.

I've had that book for decades; it was probably the first tying book I ever owned, rather than borrowed from the library. I have the impression that he added "and Bucktails" because some people might make the distinction, but he didn't.




Either way, it sure beats calling them "lures" as the Brits do.

[catskilljohn]

Either way, it sure beats calling them "lures" as the Brits do.

That reminds me of an argument I used to have with a guy who claimed streamers were not flies because they imitated baitfish His claim was it had to imitate a fly to be called a fly? I always enjoyed that one. That kind of blows the saltwater fly fishing theory... poor guys though they were fishing with flies the whole time CJ

[Eperous]

But the title Streamers and Bucktails doesn't preclude bucktails being a subset of streamers.

I've had that book for decades; it was probably the first tying book I ever owned, rather than borrowed from the library. I have the impression that he added "and Bucktails" because some people might make the distinction, but he didn't.




Either way, it sure beats calling them "lures" as the Brits do.

Yeah, the revolution is gaining momentum... there may be light at the end of this tunnel yet...

[streamertyer]

Most likely, skin strip and hair flies used by Native Americans probably preclude everything here in the states. No doubt there were many versions of minnow imitations in use well before people started trying to label them and peg their name to them for the notoriety of being 'first'.

Of course, we use the term 'Bucktails' because of the abundant deer population native to the northeast and the availability of that material then and now. I would have preferred 'Hairwing', but that's just me....

The term 'Streamer' most likely came about from hat adornments and the like (long decorative plumes). Here, I would have preferred 'featherwing', but again.... Herbie Welch (Black Ghost) claimed to be the first to tie a streamer, but this is a pretty good stretch. I think first formal accounts (here) would put it at early 1800's, though the Native Americans were probably using them before that.

At any rate, I think we all agree that the 'generic' accepted genus is 'Streamers', but for me, I still stick to Streamers and Bucktails. Good enough for guys like Bates and Schullery, probably more than good enough for me.